LabVIEW subscription model for 2022

[crossrulz]

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@Jay14159265 wrote:
NI wants to make hardware... 

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I disagree there.  I see NI pushing more to the services model, similar to what is now Agilent.  Agilent spun off their T&M into Keysight and now focuses on life sciences.  So I am actually waiting for the hardware and test to be spun off to Digilent.

[Jay14159265]

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@crossrulz wrote:

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@Jay14159265 wrote:
NI wants to make hardware... 

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I disagree there.  I see NI pushing more to the services model, similar to what is now Agilent.  Agilent spun off their T&M into Keysight and now focuses on life sciences.  So I am actually waiting for the hardware and test to be spun off to Digilent.

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You know more than I do in that regard. All I can say is that whatever they are into these days (be it hardware or services), it's apparently not LabVIEW. So if T&M went to Digilent, where do you think LabVIEW would land? 

[1100fps]

I think that is a fantastic idea.  wish I had the cash to help get an open source environment off the ground.

[labview-crash]

Rolf explained why it would be difficult (if not impossible) to open source LabVIEW, and no private company would touch it with a ten foot pole.

[beuvink]

Maybe if someone from NI is still reading this...

As far as I can see a subscription model isn't a problem at it's own.

The price isn't high cost for heavy users as it is much more efficient than any other language

The biggest issue is attracting new users & keeping existing users

Some speculation

I think NI has a serious cash issue and a huge legacy code base which is getting very costly/impossible to maintain

I think NXG was a high-risk attempt to fix this, but resources ran out before it could be finished

I think now NI has a problem

I think the subscription model is an attempt to fix the cash flow problem

I think this model back-fired dramatically

I am very afraid this may be the end for something loved very much..  38 pages are written here to express the same

I think everyone would like a solution so we can work with LabVIEW for a long time to come

I think I have an idea which may fix this: Instead of the current model, change it to a 'pay-as-you-go' model:

- Make LabVIEW free (as in free beer) for anyone, with a restriction on 'hours/month' and certain features.

- Add a pricing model where the more features or hours LabVIEW is used, the more you have to pay.

- In this case the current subscription price can be 'unlimited use' price point.

- Non-paying users are limited to this forum (which has become very active and well filled) for support so service-cost at NI doesn't explode.

[Konan__]

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As to .Net being open source, yes it is. But it isn't as functional as the Windows .Net Framework and likely never will be as far as some Windows enterprise technologies are concerned, partly simply also since that does not really translate to other platforms and/or would be a very huge undertaking to implement there as a lot of underlying technology would have to be ported too. And of course if .Net Core can't do it on non-Windows platforms then Python can't either, so it's not a point of Python vs .Net, just a limitation that stands there.

Why not use WinForms? Personally maybe because it is the umptienth GUI framework released by Microsoft with all the previous ones more or less having been abandoned. Who can guarantee you that they won't Silverlight that over a few years too for something called NetWidgets or similar?

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Sorry but you wrote the biggest false and pilecrap ever written.

Go check devexpress toolkit for winform, you will see UI and toolkit perfectly integrated into windows, LIGHT YEARS ahead of any LabVIEW GUI, 100% compatible with "Test and Measurement" concepts.

You make only FUD to mediocre programmer (the typical user of ni forum that still in 2022 ask how to send data over serial port).

Labview is dead sorry, as a platform it has no future.It's dead by design in 2022. It's tailored to mediocre programmer with a logic of "plug and play" that is obsolete in today's world

I can't even find DevCon 2022 videos lol

[alexderjuengere]

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@Konan__ wrote:

It's tailored to mediocre programmer with a logic of "plug and play" that is obsolete in today's world

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[JimB.]

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@Konan__ wrote:

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As to .Net being open source, yes it is. But it isn't as functional as the Windows .Net Framework and likely never will be as far as some Windows enterprise technologies are concerned, partly simply also since that does not really translate to other platforms and/or would be a very huge undertaking to implement there as a lot of underlying technology would have to be ported too. And of course if .Net Core can't do it on non-Windows platforms then Python can't either, so it's not a point of Python vs .Net, just a limitation that stands there.

Why not use WinForms? Personally maybe because it is the umptienth GUI framework released by Microsoft with all the previous ones more or less having been abandoned. Who can guarantee you that they won't Silverlight that over a few years too for something called NetWidgets or similar?

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Sorry but you wrote the biggest false and pilecrap ever written.

Go check devexpress toolkit for winform, you will see UI and toolkit perfectly integrated into windows, LIGHT YEARS ahead of any LabVIEW GUI, 100% compatible with "Test and Measurement" concepts.

You make only FUD to mediocre programmer (the typical user of ni forum that still in 2022 ask how to send data over serial port).

Labview is dead sorry, as a platform it has no future.It's dead by design in 2022. It's tailored to mediocre programmer with a logic of "plug and play" that is obsolete in today's world

I can't even find DevCon 2022 videos lol

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Well, that's all a bit harsh, and LabVIEW is hardly the only platform with those issues. I see silly n00b questions on C# discussion boards every day, and "plug and play" seems alive and well with the prevalence of using external packages for huge chunks of an application's functionality.

Also not sure what videos have to do with what you quoted, but you can find lots of them here: https://labviewwiki.org/wiki/Events. GDevCon 2022 is still in the future, but assuming you meant GDevCon North America, that was only a couple weeks ago and it seems pretty typical for folks to take a few weeks or so to get recordings up.

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All that said, I do think that fearmongering around WinForms is overblown. It sounds as if they are implying it is a new framework when it is in fact 20 years old, and is still being supported despite the fact that it is one of the "previous ones". Will it be around forever? Probably not. Will it disappear tomorrow? Also, probably not. Such is life.

[Taggart]

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@Konan__ wrote: Labview is dead sorry, as a platform it has no future.It's dead by design in 2022. It's tailored to mediocre programmer with a logic of "plug and play" that is obsolete in today's world

LabVIEW may not be in its heyday at the moment and there are good reasons to be skeptical about its future. It is certainly not dead. Even if NI were to make the decision to kill it today (ie LV 2022 would be the last version) it isn't going anywhere for at least 10-15 years. There are plenty of mission-critical applications out there still using it that people will still be supporting them for a while. Even converting those applications to other languages will still require a LabVIEW developer to decode what the LabVIEW code is doing. It may turn LabVIEW programmers into the equivalent of Cobol programmers, but there will still be a need for them for at least a decade or two.

As to mediocre programmers - everyone has to start somewhere. Not sure how you bring new people in if you don't cater to beginners. Not catering to beginners is a sure way to die as a programming language.

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@Konan__ wrote:

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I can't even find DevCon 2022 videos lol

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i"m not sure how not immediately posting videos within 2 weeks of a conference is relevant at all to LabVIEW's viability. This makes me question the rest of your post.

I'm not even sure why getting videos posted within 2 weeks is even an expectation? I'm curious how many conferences you've been to that post videos that quickly? I can guarantee that if they do, they have much more budget than GDevCon N.A. does. If getting videos that quickly is important to you, we are happy to accept your donation. DM me for details. I'm sure if we throw enough money at the videographer it would probably speed things up.

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@Konan__ wrote:

Sorry but you wrote the biggest false and pilecrap ever written.

I could say the same about your post.

[stevesteve]

Back onto Labview; you can still buy the perpetual LabVIEW Professional Development System.

Part number:  776678-35WM

Available from your local NI sales rep (not online).