topic Re: What I did on my summer vacation in BreakPoint

"What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Ben — Thu, 02 Aug 2018 18:43:43 GMT

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

All are welcome to post about what they do or have done that lets the rest of the world know that we are more than just machines developing code. Now if you have a LV project that you are working on in your spare time like an application that determines when your beer is ready or controls the irrigation of your gardens, those are just as valid for this thread.

If I have time I will share my new experiment to see if I can water the grape vines I have growing on one hillside from a spring I developed on another hill side.

Ben

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Ben — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 12:56:26 GMT

The experiment last night did not work out as I had hoped.

My special aptitude gets a little wonky when climbing up and down hills and along twisted paths. What I did prove is the grape vines are at a higher elevation than the spring box for spring #2 and the overflow line for the second spring works fine.

But how much higher?

That will be another test I will have to run that will require I penetrate the deeper and darker parts of the forest where I have not been in years.

If nothing else I will ID the actual elevation of spring #2 and maybe get a method of filling buckets that I can man-handle to water grape vines.

Ben

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Hooovahh — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 13:15:16 GMT

So my latest obsession at home is 3D printing. I'll probably make a blog post on my experience at some point. I bought my first 3D printer, and took about 10 hours to assemble it. After some troubleshooting, and minor fixes, and upgrades, it seems to be running like a champ and I've been printing various models that people have posted. I've just started some modeling using Solidworks and I think the first thing I'm going to try to make is some kind of project box for an ethernet controlled relay box with touch screen. So far I'm still just playing around with various filaments and settings. Here are some of the random things on my desk like a coaster, puzzle, anchor and eel using wood filament (sanded and stained) and an iris box, and jack that both printed assembled.

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

JÞB — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 18:58:29 GMT

@Ben wrote:

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

Ben

Actually, it was the converse that bothered me more (the Random Posts made it hard too follow your progress)

While you are performing the next experiment this link might be of assistance and I'ld be interested in how you apply it!

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Ben — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 19:57:45 GMT

@JÞB wrote:

@Ben wrote:

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

Ben

Actually, it was the converse that bothered me more (the Random Posts made it hard too follow your progress)

While you are performing the next experiment this link might be of assistance and I'ld be interested in how you apply it!

That (along with planting about 5 grape vines) is exactly what I was trying to do tonight. What stopped me last night was it was getting late and dragging the PEX line back down the hill into the gulley through ;

Japanese Barberry (spine the will pierce leather gloves),

Mulitflora Rose (Flesh eating thorns),

Wild Black Raspberries (hazardous but at least they produce good fruit),

Wild grape vines, and

then there is the Poison Ivy....

Requires an approach it like trying to get Dorthy out of her Ruby Slippers, "These things must done delicately." and not rushed.

If I drag the line down the hill far enough the water should come out and when I hold at point that is level with the overflow of the of the spring box I will have a reference point that I can work with to determine if switching over to spring #1 that has a spring box about 4 feet above spring #2.

my brother does have a laser level but by the time I set it up measure move lather rinse repeat, It would take even more time.

I did see another approach that involved a forked stick with a level mounted on it. An operator help the stick with the forks side up and the spirit level centered. Eye-ball from the short branch to the long and mark the line on the longer fork even with the first fork.

From that point forward the operator would hold it level eye-ball across the two branches and then spot a tree in the distance. Best to have an assistant mark the point but for rough leveling, just remember where on the tree was the level line. Proceed as you would expect.

The other thing that complicates the figuring is the absolute jungle the forest area is. I read people talking about this gun or that gun and taking out a target at 500 yards. Round here you can't see 50 yards!

Ben

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

JÞB — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 20:23:35 GMT

@Ben wrote:

@JÞB wrote:

@Ben wrote:

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

Ben

Actually, it was the converse that bothered me more (the Random Posts made it hard too follow your progress)

While you are performing the next experiment this link might be of assistance and I'ld be interested in how you apply it!

That (along with planting about 5 grape vines) is exactly what I was trying to do tonight. What stopped me last night was it was getting late and dragging the PEX line back down the hill into the gulley through ;

Japanese Barberry (spine the will pierce leather gloves),

Mulitflora Rose (Flesh eating thorns),

Wild Black Raspberries (hazardous but at least they produce good fruit),

Wild grape vines, and

then there is the Poison Ivy....

Requires an approach it like trying to get Dorthy out of her Ruby Slippers, "These things must done delicately." and not rushed.

If I drag the line down the hill far enough the water should come out and when I hold at point that is level with the overflow of the of the spring box I will have a reference point that I can work with to determine if switching over to spring #1 that has a spring box about 4 feet above spring #2.

my brother does have a laser level but by the time I set it up measure move lather rinse repeat, It would take even more time.

I did see another approach that involved a forked stick with a level mounted on it. An operator help the stick with the forks side up and the spirit level centered. Eye-ball from the short branch to the long and mark the line on the longer fork even with the first fork.

From that point forward the operator would hold it level eye-ball across the two branches and then spot a tree in the distance. Best to have an assistant mark the point but for rough leveling, just remember where on the tree was the level line. Proceed as you would expect.

The other thing that complicates the figuring is the absolute jungle the forest area is. I read people talking about this gun or that gun and taking out a target at 500 yards. Round here you can't see 50 yards!

Ben

If it is any consolation at all, only @%95 humans react to poison ivy. (Boy, did that P.O. the XMB <not the LMB> when she found out that she, and three children, were not in the same %5 I was)

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

JÞB — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 22:18:59 GMT

@Ben wrote:

@JÞB wrote:

@BenRound here you can't see 50 yards!

Ben

30-30 Winchester lever action 24" barrel

Still good @ 200+yds - Snaps around nicely for those 50yd- shots.

Way- Back When... I've taken deer on both extremes with that machine.

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Ben — Mon, 06 Aug 2018 13:05:46 GMT

@JÞB ...Ben

If it is any consolation at all, only @%95 humans react to poison ivy. (Boy, did that P.O. the XMB <not the LMB> when she found out that she, and three children, were not in the same %5 I was)

While I have gotten poison Ivy a couple of times, I seem to be partially immune because I come away clear while others suffer from it. In one case my better--half got it bad after washing the clothes I was wearing when working in the woods. Not a spec on me but her fore arms were covered.

This video is an updated from Saturday night after a day of digging.

And to put the amount of dirt we dug up and moved this...

path down the hill wide enough for a power wagon and between 25 and 30 feet long, did not exist on Saturday morning.

One more thing to notice in that image. That coil of white PEX tubing in the top left corner, is the line k from up on the hill. Turns out that line was clogged! Running that drip still work! I will try to find out tonight when I run a new line.

Ben

Water does not flow down hill. A open appeal for help answering why it does not

Ben — Tue, 07 Aug 2018 12:45:32 GMT

Here is the video showing the set-up where water is not flowing down hill the way I had hoped it would.

After dragging the 100' coil of 1/2 PEX down the hill and flattening out the coils I did get very small flow.

What has me asking questions is why does the flow stop when I left the delivery end of the line more than 4-5 feet off of the ground?

Never having been schooled on water lines etc. I am thinking it has to do with the long run of 1/2 PEX and resistance. But that would only explain the low flow and not the fact that it stops flow when lifted only 5 feet.

I have me some learning to do!

Ben

Re: Water does not flow down hill. A open appeal for help answering why it does not

JÞB — Tue, 07 Aug 2018 19:42:47 GMT

Capillary action?

Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

Ben — Wed, 08 Aug 2018 12:39:04 GMT

@JÞB wrote:

Capillary action?

I could believe it.

Now how would that fit with the fact that after just letting it sit over night there was good flow coming out the end when I checked it last night?

The over-flow was not flowing so the water was all going the way I wanted it to go. I had my brother with me and he took up a position between where I was on the far hill and he could site both me and the spring box. As I climbed the far hill the water stopped again and he declared that I was still below the spring box. Since last night was not a night intended for playing wit the water, I left the delivery end hanging in a tree branch to see if letting is sit over night would let it start again.

After all I more digging and dumping to do.

Ben

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

richferrara — Wed, 08 Aug 2018 13:11:09 GMT

Here's my LabWindows project that plays the dice game Lights Out (a/k/a Shut The Box or High Rollers).

Shut The Box - Wikipedia

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

JÞB — Wed, 08 Aug 2018 23:54:03 GMT

@Ben wrote:

@JÞB wrote:

Capillary action?

I could believe it.

Now how would that fit with the fact that after just letting it sit over night there was good flow coming out the end when I checked it last night?

Ben

OK Ben, Time for some practical physics. (Imagine a physicist asking these questions?)

First, Just go flush your toilet! I'm not kidding!

What you have in that line besides the capillary action is a trap or two where the slope is less than 1/4in"/' That's what it takes to overcome surface tension in fresh water (+/- some for dissolved salts and Ph <>7 Salts reduce Surface tension Free H and OH ions increase surface tension A hydrometer will give you the specific gravity, density is proportional to tension)

However, Surface tension works FOR you when there is no water air surface (Purged line) and you get a "Siphon" that overcomes the trap.

Did you flush again? While you are looking at that marvelous contraption (Ironically invented by one plumber named "Crapper" although John Harrington is usually named the inventor and Cummings stole the patent) But I digress....Looking at you home throne closely you might notice that VENT in your roof! This is to let the air out of the line so that water can create that, oh so important, siphon.

three rules of plumbing:

Sh!t goes down
Stink goes up
Water seeks its own level

Add a vent, plug the bottom end, evacuate the air to prime the siphon (yes Ben, I said "Suck on it")

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

crossrulz — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 11:16:51 GMT

@JÞB wrote:

(Ironically invented by one plumber named "Crapper" although John Harrington is usually named the inventor and Cummings stole the patent)

It's actually not ironic. All of the toilets in the UK said "Crapper" on them, since that was the company name. So when all of those US soldiers entered WWI, they saw this and just started calling toilets "crappers". But I digress even more...

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

Ben — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 12:58:22 GMT

Good info Jeff.

As the rain fell last night I put on a rain coat to see what I could figure out. Mind you I did not have access to your reply before this morning so here goes...

The line was raised about 4 more inches. Still need to overcome the crest which requires another 4 foot of elevation.

That is enough flow to keep the grape vines from drying out. So as the rain petered out, I did some thinking and I believe I have a way understanding. I would have to do a lot of hand waving but here goes it.

The various elevations can be though of a voltage potentials. The various lengths and diameters of PEX tubing can be thought of as resistors. Now for the hand waving. The capillary effect inside the tubing act like back to back diodes. Until I have enough potential to forward bias the diodes in one direction or another, there is no current flow. The other factor is the weather and with a high pressure system the air is denser and the potential for each foot of head changes with the weather patterns. I will skip drawing up the diagram but all of the factors are either fixed or out of my control except the attributes of the delivery line running up out of the gulley. I can reduce the length to a minimum required to reach the grape vines AND I can switch to larger size line going from 1/2″ to 3/4″.

I have a partial roll of 3/4" PEX sitting on the front stoop just waiting for me to come home from work.

One way or anther I will report on the results.

Now if you can see a reason why worth trying, let me know and I will spare the PEX and do more digging instead.

Ben

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

JÞB — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 14:06:15 GMT

Consider the tank a capacitor, the static head battery ant the tube more like an inductor. Charge that inductor by priming it and not only does it not impede current, it resists flow change. The inner diameter and capillary action, e.g smoothness, in the resistance.

Diodes are check-valves and forward bias is a spring-load to closed. You might want one near the intake to lock in the water in the pipe when the tank gets low.

Like putting your finger on a straw and lifting it as an experiment.

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

JÞB — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 14:38:07 GMT

Run small scale experiments with the grand gals!

Post video!

Prove the analogies

Longer tube more inductance takes longer to fill discharging the tank ( replacing water with hoses air)

Lift the tank, ( more voltage in the battery ) hose fills faster increased flow rate.

Smaller tank volume empties faster.

Raise hose intake out of the tank flow decays just like current from an inductor (bet you can even find the same rl and rc curves)

Stick your finger on the top. Check valve inductor applies force upstream holding water, charge, in the inductor, Tube.

Bonus points. Have the gals find the resistive element I have not mentioned.

No cheating! Don't tell Ben!

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

jcarmody — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 16:49:18 GMT

@Ben wrote:

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

All are welcome to post about what they do or have done that lets the rest of the world know that we are more than just machines developing code. [...]

Ben

I play games with guns.

Re: Water eventually started to flow, I have a witness!

Ben — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 16:53:11 GMT

I mentioned this challenge to one of my associates and as soon as I said "3/4 to 1/2" he interrupted and predicted that it would only flow about 1/3 to 1/2 way up... He then stopped and said "I did take that course and did all of the math."

So I am looking forward to trying it out tonight.

That section of 3/4 I have to test with may not run all of the way there but the test should be revealing.

Ben

Re: "What Software Developers Do When They Are Not Developing Software".

Ben — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 17:12:59 GMT

@jcarmody wrote:

@Ben wrote:

I have introduced a little too much chaos to the random post thread so I will be using this thread when I am tempted to share reports of non-LV related activities.

All are welcome to post about what they do or have done that lets the rest of the world know that we are more than just machines developing code. [...]

Ben

I play games with guns.

"Uncle!"

I have to admit that your gun range looks like a lot more fun than my gun range!

Ben