Ultiboard 11 crashes when I move a part

[dbur]

Ultiboard 11.0.278 randomly crashes when I move a part.  I didn't notice much problem with this in the previous release.  (I haven't upgraded to the last release update since the installer is not compatible with upating when you still have V10 installed)

Usually I can start up again with no problem, but on several occasions it's resulted in a corrupted design file that can no longer be opened. (Thank goodness for the security copy).

It seems to happen most often when other parts get bumped as a result of the move, though not always.

My video drivers are updated.

Anyone else notice this?

[_user32]

dbur,

Have you tried the updated patch for v11 - I think that will help.

http://forums.ni.com/t5/Circuit-Design-Suite-Multisim/Software-Update-11-0-0-2-for-NI-Circuit-Design...

If this patch does not seem to rectify your exact problem, please contact our support engineers, if you have not already done so:

http://sine.ni.com/apps/utf8/nicc.call_me?p_lang_id=us    and choose "Request Support"

Regards,Patrick Noonan
Business Development Manager
National Instruments - Electronics Workbench Group

[dbur]

Yes, I'm fully updated.  No difference.  Doesn't crash with 'Full real time check' turned off.

This has been an issue on all updated versions for some time now.  I wish they would fix it.

David B

[Tien_P]

Hi David,

There is likely something in your file that is causing the crash, would you please create a service request by going to the support page below and send us your file.

http://www.ni.com/support/

[dbur]

After working on a design a while with real time check off I could no longer get it to crash after turning it back on.  

Every fresh transfer to UB will crash like this when I move/shove parts around with real time check on.

I've attached a file that does this.  Make sure you have real time checking on, and just randomly move parts around shoving some others out of the way and UB crashes within a minute of so of this.

[Tien_P]

Hi,

Thank you for providing the file! 

I tested your file on two computers, one with XP and the other with Win 7 64-bit and I was able to replicate the crash in both machines.   I will pass your file to R&D so that the can investigate this problem.

I've not had many customers reporting this problem and since this often happened to you, my suggestion is to reset your configuration file.  When you transfer a new netlist from Multisim to Ultiboard, your configuration file will be use and if there is something wrong in that file you will see it in all your designs. 

For instructions how to reset the Ultiboard configuration file, please refer to the following knowledge base:

http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/2719D00E36A4D53A8625721300685B3F?OpenDocument

[dbur]

I had just reset my config file before preparing this file due to it having become corrupted.

[_user32]

dbur,

At first I wasn't able to get this to crash - I even put the large TH grid into the bank of resistors with no issues.   I then reopened the design and did a fresh move on one of the DSUB connectors into the same area and then moved around some parts and then I also saw the issue.

R&D will definitely have to take a look at this one, but the silver lining is that we are seeing it replicated - so they will likely be able to find the defect.

Regards,

Pat

[markut]

Its true!! Multisim itself is full of error code build. bad manipulation of core spice engine. try the virtual components and all just fails even after disconnection of wires, a transistor 2N3055 of 15 amp capable, just seems to blow with 100ma current, just because its virtual...!! ??. ultiboard is just as bad, moving components, i didn't see any manual rip up of the traces...?? It crashes..hangs...badddddds!! i tried a trial version of 30 days, now.. with such errrooorrr how will i even think of using this software for my business???

[_user32]

Markut,

I do appreciate your response but I do want to respond to your post on a few items.   Also it would help if you were more clear on your criticism or to attach a file or an example to identify which issue you are having problems with so that we can address specific items rather than just your general frustration.  

First of all, we do much benchmarking of our SPICE simulation engine against other leading SPICE packages and we get very comparable results (some minor differences due to the setup of SPICE parameters) on a wide variety of test circuits.  If there are specific issues you are seeing (such as the 2N3055 model) we would like to see the example that you've been working with to diagnose the issue or give you a suggested work around and we can even likely run the circuit in another simulator to assist in comparison.   We typically rely on manufacturer specific SPICE model data, and although we do catch errors in some of these models, we cannot guarantee that all models are going to work in every application circuit.   Some SPICE models are configured to work in the nominal case with only slight variation, while some others are configured to work in a broad range of operational and environmental conditions, and we rely on the manufacturer to include this information in the model - this does vary from mfg to mfg.   SPICE is a very useful tool, but the user does need to be aware of any assumptions that are part of the models that are being used.   We would be happy to work with any of our users to help identify limitations in the SPICE models as they are being used in Multisim.

Second regarding Ultiboard, we have greatly improved the behavior and eliminated many of the crash scenarios in Ultiboard over the past several years.   I use it heavily and I rarely experience a crash scenario.   If you have had a crash and can identify the prior steps, we do work diligently (as we did above with dbur) to reproduce the problem and send this information to R&D for corrective action in a future release.   Also we've added some features such that if a crash does occur you can recover your work.   If you go to the menu, and select Options -> Global Preferences -> General (tab) -> Enable auto save (check box), you can greatly reduce the chance that you will lose any work when using Ultiboard.

To manually rip up traces, you have several options.   First you can go to the spreadsheet view (on the bottom) and any net you can right click on and select "Remove copper" - this will remove copper associated with the entire net you've selected.   If you only want to rip up a small segment of copper, you can go into the layout area, click on the segment you'd like to rip up and hit the <Delete> key.   In the same right click menu you can choose "Select entire trace" which will highlight the contiguous attached segment, and you can delete that portion.

In general the spreadsheet view is very valuable in setting up constraints, managing nets and parts, and overall working with your design.   If you are not familiar with the spreadsheet view, you should become aware of this workspace and this will allow you to use Ultiboard properly.

Regards,

Pat Noonan

National Instruments