LabVIEW Real-Time Idea Exchange

We have some software which runs in different versions on the same hardware and in testing, we often need to have the software running for benchmarking or debugging from the development environment.

A major pain is the inability for devices within a single project to share an IP address (when not connected).  I would suggest that multiple targets within a single project should be allowed to have the same IP address set (although of course only one can be connected at a time).

Shane.

As cRIO's are deployed in ever growing applications, it would sure be nice if there was an option to use SFTP (and disable FTP altogheter) on the controller. Ideally it would be supported at the OS level, i.e. the existing cRIO FTP server is upgraded or extended to include SFTP as well.

If this is already supported, try searching for "sftp" or "crio sftp" and you'll see only one 3rd party tool-kit, but I confirmed with that company (Labwerx.net) that it (labSSH) does not support cRIO/FPGA/RT targets and there are no concrete plans to add support to other targets.

NI: I call on you to either create the FTP toolkit I need to write my own SFTP server, or better yet, update the cRIO FTP server to include the "s". . . It is only one letter, how hard can that be!?  

If this is already possible through some (obscure?) way, please update your site-search engine to reckognize sftp and/or crio sftp, and/or link to a KB or Whitepaper on the topic as I did not find any.

(Note: cRIO safety and security IS covered in pretty good detail in the article series starting with Overview of Best Practices for Security on RIO Systems and the linked 3 articles.)

Currently, you can view the console from MAX, but if you don't know what buttons to press... lets just say it's in there somewhere. My idea is to make it more accessible, such as a right mouse button feature off the RT Target.

Hello,

It should be nice to be abble to duplicate a CRio target easily. 

=> Be abble to duplicate the Target

=> Be abble to duplicate the backplane configuration

=> Be abble to duplicate a FPGA target

It should also be nice to be able to change easily ...

=> The CRIo type

=> The CRio backplane type

Some commands to manipulate targets are missing ... or are hidden  ...

For example the copy/paste commands are available by key stroke ... but are not visible thru the Labview project treeview context menu.

I think that the usability of the targets manipulations should be improved. 

Thanks for help.

Manu.net 

It would be very convenient if we could format and install the OS/RTE on a target directly from the project window.

Currently, if I'm about to deploy a new application I typically format the target, install the OS software on it, then I deploy the application onto it...and finally I make an image of it that will serve as a way for others to deploy the application to production targets.

This involves use of NI MAX (format and install OS), LabVIEW (deply app) and RAD (make image). Doing all these operations (image-making as well would be great) from LabVIEW would make the workflow much nicer.

PS. In the project window today you have Utilities>>System Manager. The described operations should be available directly from the menu, but it would also feel natural to have these options from the system manager.

Currently, if you have hardware in a LabVIEW project (e.g. a cRIO controller, cRIO chassis, or R-Series PXI card), the only way that you can change this to another product is by adding a new one to the project and deleting the old one. It would be nice to be able to use a configuration window to change the model number of a piece of hardware to a different, but similar one. For example, if you have a 9072 in the project but wanted to change it to a 9073. Another example would be the ability to change, via menus, a PXI 7813R to a 7854R. Of course the user would have to update any code written to account for changes due to the new hardware. This is especially convenient when you are simulating and configuring test systems but aren't quite sure exactly what hardware you need. Currently, for each new piece of hardware (similar or not) you have to create a new device and copy all of the IO, VIs, libraries, etc. under the new device in the project.

Today we have to remember to build the application prior to deploying it. Instead of just throwing an error if we choose to deploy without having built first; either automatically run a build if necessary, or offer to do so.

Very often it would also be nice to just be able to select "Run as startup", and get all 3 stages done automatically (build, deploy, run as startup).

It should be nice to add a new "Build specification" in Labview RT which could generated something like a RT Target installer.

This installer could contain ...

• The application to download
• The drivers required
• Additionnal custom files and directories
• The default setting of the target ( Like the MAX target configuration)

When the installer is executed, it should be nice to show all the available targets ( Like in Max ).

The user should have to select the destination Target in this list.

Then it should be nice to show the target configuration (like in Max), initialized with the setting contained in the installer.

An installation could be like this ...

1. Launching the installer
2. The installer lists all available (and compatible) targets
3. The user has to choose a target
4. After target selection, the installer should view the target configuration ( as defined in the Labview project Build specification properties )
5. The user could then modify some parameters (like IP address)
6. After validating the configuration, the installer should
7. Install the drivers ... and perhaps the OS itself (as required by the project)
8. Modify the target parameters 
9. Install the application
10. Set Time/hour according to host target
11. Download custom files and directories ..
12. ...
13. And restart the target

This feature could be an easy way to deploy RT application without having a Labview RT installed on the host computer.

A RT application could be installed completely by a final customer of the application, without having to install the Target, drivers ...

This could also be nice to clone many times a RT application.

Hello,

I have recently to work with a RT application.

In this application, i used a property node in order to get all values of an ENUM.

=> This feature works fine when you debug your application using LabVIEW on the host ! 

=> But the same code doesn't work in real RT execution. 

I know very well that some property nodes doesn't work in RT programming, but when you have to go from windows application, to FPGA, to Crio, ... you often forgot this point ! LabVIEW should help us to limit this kind of mistakes !

It would be nice, if LabVIEW could break RT VI's, or generate a list of warning during RT application build, when an application is using non RT compatible property nodes !

It would be nice to get this warning during the compilation time, and not only at runtime ! 

It would also be nice, if the LabView RT debug tool could generates the same errors than a real RT target.

Thanks for help.

Manu.net

When developing RT code (especially system upgrades) it would be truly helpful to have a virtual machine (VMware, MS Virtual PC, Sun Virtual box, etc....) that would allow us to run the actual VxWorks OS and LVRT in it's native environment, within the Windows OS. This would allow the code to run on the actual RTOS (I realize that determinism would be scacrificed) and provide the ability to actually test the functionality of the code in the actual environment to ensure that it runs as it should. It would also preclude the need to have a bunch of RT controllers sitting on the shelf in the event that you might need them.

There is and emulator for PDA module, why not for RT.

The best thing about Pharlap is that it will run dll's like Windows.

Making shared libraries for VxWorks (*.out files) is quite an arduous process if you don't have Wind River software.  The GNU toolchain, that used to be the free alternative, does not work on Windows Vista or 7, leaving those of use who have chosen to upgrade out of luck.

It would be great is LabVIEW could provide a way to compile *.out files from the Application Builder and thereby provide more complete support for development on the CompactRIO platform.

When working in the Windows development environment the application builder has the ability to implement a version number for the built executable. Additionally LabVIEW has the ability to querry this version number through a property node. I would like to see this feature carried over to RT systems as well. It would be very helpful in determining what particular build of the startup.rtexe file is running on the target.

I am often working with a compact RIO and I need to change the IP configuration or the software settings. Currently I have to open up MAX refresh my target list (which can sometime take a minute or two since we have so many targets). Then open up the RT target settings.

I think the IP address and software settings should be accessible from the project window by right-clicking on the target and selecting properties.

The MAX settings page could be reproduced in the general settings section that all ready has a limited ability to edit the IP.

You could also add a  software category, so you could update the version of RIO or install scan engine.

When running a VI in development mode while targeting an RT device, you must "Save All" prior to deployment. This is annoying, especially when using SCC. I'm sure that SourceOnly will minimize this effect in LV2010, but the concept still remains: I don't want to be forced to Save All when I don't want my edits (or automatic linking edits) to persist.

On all of the RT platforms, if the CPU maxes out at 100% the RTOS goes through a sort of "load shedding" and begins suspending non critical threads to lower the CPU overhead and hopefully maintain determinism. One of the first threads that gets suspended is the TCP thread which essentially cuts off the RT target from the ethernet and outside world.

While I understand the concept of the load shedding, I believe that if you have the CPU pushed that hard, then your determinism is out the window anyway. Dropping the TCP thread only serves to disconnect the RT system from the development environment or the built application with no real benefit. I have yet to see a single application that was actually able to accomplish anything substantial after the point that the TCP thread was suspended. In most cases, the high CPU usage happens during the development of the application or when something is critically wrong with the setup of the deployed app. In those cases, it wouldn't matter how many threads you suspended, the CPU will still be maxed out.

It is akin to blowing out a match in the midst of a forrest fire.

I would propose that the RTOS be reconfigured to show the TCP thread as one of the critical threads and keep it from being suspended during high CPU excursions OR give the developer the option to turn this feature on or off throgh the device properties.

I know there has been some discussion in other areas about an "Android build" of LabVIEW, but I am thinking specifically about the Touch Panel Module.  An option to target and deploy an HMI onto a low-cost, readily available Android tablet would be tremendous for RT projects, in my opinion.  I've got 2 different projects right now that require expensive Win7 tablet PCs, but all they are doing is running a custom LV application to be used as a basic HMI, which is complete overkill.  I know the webserver is an option, but it has some limits, and I'd like to have multiple varieties of HMIs available to show varying degrees of system data and performance, which gets dicey with a webserver situation (at least, in my experiences so far).

It just seems like expanding the TPM so that it's keeping up with the times (Android and iOS dominance) seems like a win/win for NI and developers.